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JF1639: Breaking Down the T-12: Apartment Financial Statements Part 3 of 6 | Syndication School with Theo Hicks

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Last week’s syndication school episodes were all about the rent roll. This week, Theo is talking about the T-12 (trailing 12, profit & loss statement) it has different names sometimes, but we’ll refer to it as simply the T-12. We’ve provided a free T-12 from an actual deal in the notes below. You’ll need to know how to read this statement for your apartment syndication business. If you never plan to buy larger apartment buildings, you’ll still need this skill for smaller properties if you want to accurately perform your due diligence. If you enjoyed today’s episode remember to subscribe in iTunes and leave us a review!

 

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Free Document (Real T-12 from a deal):

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TRANSCRIPTION

Joe Fairless: There needed to be a resource on apartment syndication that not only talked about each aspect of the syndication process, but how to actually do each of the things, and go into it in detail… And we thought “Hey, why not make it free, too?” That’s why we launched Syndication School.

Theo Hicks will go through a particular aspect of apartment syndication on today’s episode, and get into the details of how to do that particular thing. Enjoy this episode, and for more on apartment syndication and how to do things, go to apartmentsyndication.com, or to learn more about the Apartment Syndication School, go to syndicationschool.com, so you can listen to all the previous episodes.

 

Theo Hicks: Hi, Best Ever listeners. Welcome back to another episode of the Syndication School series –  a free resource focused on the how-to’s of apartment syndication. As always, I am your host, Theo Hicks.

Each week we air two podcast episodes that are focused on a specific aspect of the apartment syndication investment strategy, that is raising money from passive investors to buy apartments and sharing in the profits. And for the majority of these podcast episodes, which together will create a series, we will offer a document or a spreadsheet or some kind of resource for you to download for free. All of these documents, as well as the past Syndication School series can be found at SyndicationSchool.com.

This episode is part three of a series entitled “Breaking down the apartment financials.” Last week in parts one and two we broke down the first financial document that you need in order to underwrite a deal, which is the rent roll; it is essentially a schedule of rents at the property. It’s a document that breaks down who’s living in what unit, at what rent, and what other charges and at what lease terms. That is one of the documents that you need in order to underwrite a new deal, and that’s also one of the documents you will want to provide to your passive investors on an ongoing basis.

In this part three, as well as tomorrow’s episode part four, we will be focusing on the second financial document that you need in order to underwrite a deal, as well as the second financial document you will want to provide to your passive investors after you’ve acquired the deal, and that is the T-12, also known as the Trailing 12-month financials, the profit and loss statement… It has different names, depending on who you’re talking to, but essentially, the T-12 is going to be a financial statement that details the income and expenses of an apartment community over a 12-month period. It’s Excel, or it could be in PDF too, with a bunch of rows for each of the various different income and expense categories. At the end, it will provide you with a net operating income, and there also will be a list of the other expenses, and some non-operating expenses, to eventually come to the net income, which is the actual cashflow you’re receiving at the property.

So in these next two parts we’re going to go through a sample T-12, which you can download for free at SyndicationSchool.com, and we’re gonna go ahead and go through each of these line items and define them, explain what they are, as well as what to look for when you’re analyzing a T-12 during the underwriting process, as well as when you are analyzing it on an ongoing basis.

But first, what is the T-12 used for, which is something I’ve already mentioned at the beginning of this podcast – essentially, you’re gonna use a T-12 at two points in your business plan. First, you’re gonna use it during the underwriting process. When you’re underwriting the deal, you’re gonna want to use the current owner’s profit and loss statement, trailing T-12 as a guide for first inputting that data into your cashflow calculator, so you know how the property is currently operating.

Then you will also use that as a guide for making your income and expense assumptions for once you actually stabilize the asset. We’ll talk about how to do that here in a little bit, probably actually in tomorrow’s episode, part four. But we wanna hit on some of it in this episode, at least for the income line items.

So you set these assumptions based on the T-12, as well as conversations with the property management company, to get an understanding of what the market expenses are. Then you wanna do a rental comp to figure out what your new rents are going to be, and then based on that, once your model is completed, you’ll submit an offer to the seller. Once the offer is accepted, all of these assumptions you made based on this T-12, at least in part, will then be confirmed during the due diligence phase, through a variety of due diligence reports and working with your property management continually… Which will result in a finalized projected budget, or a proforma for the property.

Essentially, you’ll be able to forecast out the income and expense line items for each year you plan on holding on to the property, which at the end of that business plan, when you decide to sell, you’ll have a projected NOI each year, so that if you sell at year 5, you’ll be like “Okay, well at year five my forecasted NOI is this, the in-place cap rate is 5%, so I’m gonna assume a 5,5% cap rate at sale”, and then you can determine how much money you’re gonna sell the property for. So the T-12 is pretty important on the front-end, for certain, but you will also use it on the back-end when you actually have the property under management and you are implementing your business plan, because as I said, you created a forecasted budget, so you’re gonna have to track the performance of the property on a monthly basis and compare that to your initial forecasted budget, to make sure that you are on track to meet your return projections… And if there is a big variance, then you’re gonna want to strategize with your management company to 1) identify what the issue is, and 2) determine how to rectify that issue.

Then you’re also gonna want to send those T-12’s to your investors as well, so they can essentially do the exact same thing – compare how the property is actually performing to how you forecasted the property to perform.

We actually provide our T-12’s as well as the rent roll to our investors on a quarterly basis. Technically, you can do it each month, but we do it on a quarterly basis.

Before we jump into defining the terms on the example T-12, I wanna just take a step back and give you an overall big picture of what the T-12 is and how it’s organized before we go into the specifics.

When you download the free T-12 example from an actual deal that Joe has done – the deal is sold, so we’re able to use t as an example – across the top you’re gonna see a different column for each month, and then below that the rows are going to be different types of incomes or expenses. Typically, there’s going to be an income category, and then under the income category things are gonna be broken down into Rental Revenue, so things that are related to rents, and then you’re gonna see another subcategory of other tenant income… So that’s essentially how the T-12 flows – it starts with the income, and then it’s got various sub-categories of the income, and then below that there’s specific line items that make up those sub-categories.

Then the same thing for expenses, you’re gonna have the overall category, so Operating Expenses, for example, and then what are the operating expenses – there’s utilities, so that’s a subcategory, and then under utilities you’ve got Water, Electric, Gas… Then a total utilities of all those are this number. So that’s how it flows. You’ve got your major categories, which are the income, and the expense, and then below those you’re gonna have various subcategories, and then below those you’ll have even more subcategories, and then at the smallest detail will be the specific thing for the overall subcategory. Then at the bottom of that it will add all those smaller metrics together to give you the overall Other Tenant Income, for example.

When you’re actually underwriting the deal, if the deal is on-market, then you’ll get this T-12 from the listing broker. If the deal is off-market, then you’ll get it from either the owner, or whoever the point person is. The other point person will probably just be the property management company.

For larger apartment deals that you’re looking at – this is kind of general, but properties that  are 50 units or more, or deals that are professionally managed, will likely have a very detailed T-12. The tongue-twister I was explaining earlier about the major categories, and under that you’ve got subcategories, and under that even more subcategories, until you have the individual line items – that’s gonna be a very detailed T-12, where essentially every single individual expense or income is assigned its own code. For example, code 4100 is gonna be late charges. So whenever there’s a late charge, that’s input into that, as opposed to lumping late charges into other income and just having that one other income line item.

So those are gonna be the ideal T-12’s, because the more detailed the T-12, the better it is for you when you’re underwriting the deal, because you can actually see what each of the major categories are consisted of, and it also is very helpful when you are obviously trying to compare your projected budget to what’s actually happening, because again, rather than saying, “Oh, well Other Income is really low. I wonder what’s going on”, instead you’re gonna be like “Alright, well Other Income is really low; let’s take a look at the 25 different line items that make up the Other Income. Oh, okay, it looks like our parking fees are really low compared to our budget, so that’s something that we need to focus on.” Whereas for smaller deals — so these are deals that are, again, generally 50 units or below, as well as deals that are not professionally managed, so these are kind of mom-and-pop properties, then you may still have that detailed T-12, but it’s more likely that you’re gonna have a less detailed T-12. Maybe you’ll have the Income category, and then below that you’ll have rental revenue, but that’s it; it doesn’t break it down further. So Rental Revenue is rent, loss to lease, vacancy loss, employee discounts; on a detailed T-12 you’ll have individual line items for those metrics, but if it’s not detailed, you might just have Rental Income and Other Income. And for expenses it might just have like Utilities and Maintenance and Repairs, and it doesn’t break it down any further than that.

As I mentioned, the less detailed the T-12, you’ve gotta rely more heavily on your property management company to set those income and expense assumptions… Because if you can’t see what each of the categories are consisted of, then you’re not going to be able to determine what you’ll be able to do better, or what’s going to be worse, or what’s gonna be held the same; it would be impossible to know, because all you have is the total sum of all those individual line items.

After acquiring the asset, your property management company should track all of these income and expense figures and then provide you with an updated T-12 on a monthly basis. So when you’re initially reaching out to your property companies, if you remember back in an earlier series, one of the things that you ask them was what kind of property management software they use, and the type of property management software they use will determine the types of reports that it can generate… And you might wanna ask them for a sample report. It does not need to be filled out with the actual numbers from a property, but you wanna know what types of metrics they track, and you’re gonna want to see, again, the larger categories, the rental revenue categories, the utility categories – you’re gonna wanna see those broken down to the actual individual components that make up that overall category.

Now, the major difference between a T-12 that you received during the underwriting process and the T-12 that you received from your property management company after you’ve acquired the property, besides obviously the numbers being different, is going to be an extra column at the end, which is the variance column. The variance column is going to be essentially the actual numbers minus the forecasted numbers. Ideally, the variance is 0 or a positive number, because that means that you are either meeting or exceeding your forecast. If it’s negative, that means that something is happening and you are not sticking to your budget.

If you remember, I mentioned about your property management company that they’re gonna be the one that signs off on your budget initially, so during the underwriting process, as you sign off on your budget, as well as during the due diligence period… So if any income or expense line item or category differs greatly from your budget, so it has a large negative variance, then you’re gonna want to look at the individual line items under that larger category to see if you can figure out what caused the issue.

For example, if my total rental revenue is a negative variance, and then I look through the individual line items and see “Okay, well my loss to lease was supposed to be $100,000, but now it’s $200,000”, and that is accounting for 90% of that variance, then I can go back and reach out to my property management company and say “Hey, this loss to lease is varying greatly from our projection. What’s going on? What do we need to do in order to fix this?”

Since your return projections are based on your budget, if you have these large variances, then that’s going to impact your returns… So you’re gonna want to identify the cause of these variances quickly and then resolve those quickly as well.

Now, for the remainder of this episode, as well as part three (next episode) we’re going to walk through an example of T-12 for a deal that Joe did. We’re going to define the major categories I was telling you about, as well as the subcategories and those line items that make up those subcategories, as well as explain what to look for when you’re analyzing this T-12 during the underwriting process and during the post-acquisition phase.

I’m going to try to go through this as detailed as possible, but it would be helpful if you had the sample T-12 that I’m going to go over in front of you. So if you go to the resources site, or if you look at the show notes, you should be able to download the example T-12 that I will be referring to for the remainder of this episode.

This T-12 was actually for a 200+ unit deal that Joe did in Dallas, Texas. At the time that this T-12 was pulled, they were 14 months into a value-add business plan, and a little bit over 130 units had been upgraded, with about 80 being upgraded by Joe and his team, and then 50 being renovated by the previous owner. So about a little over halfway through the value-add business plan. And again, since this is a T-12 for one of Joe’s deals, this is going to be a very detailed T-12, so you’re gonna have all those line items that you want when you’re underwriting, as well as when you’re going to analyze on an ongoing basis.

In this episode I want to try to get through all of the Income section, and then in the next episode we’re gonna focus strictly on the expenses. So if you have a T-12 open – or if not, just follow along – the first  category under Income is going to be the Rental Revenue. Overall, the Income section we’re gonna discuss today is gonna include all the metrics and factors that are related to the revenue of the apartment community, so that is money that is coming in.

Generally, it’s going to be broken down into two categories – you’re gonna have the rental revenue (the rents), and then the other one is going to be any other income that you’re bringing in. Then both of these categories will obtain various subcategories and various line items that make up the larger Rental Revenue and Other Income categories.

For the first one, Rental Revenue, it’s going to include the various incomes and various losses that are associated with the money collected from leased and non-leased units.

First you’re gonna see Rent – pretty self-explanatory. Actually, it’s not self-explanatory. What this is actually referring to is the gross potential rent. That is going to be the total amount of rent that would be collected if all the units were leased, and if all the units were leased at current market rates. So this is not the actual rent collected, this is essentially the total market rent.

So when you’re underwriting, you’re going to want to make sure that this gross potential rent for the most recent month – in this case November 2017 – it doesn’t need to be exactly the same as that rent roll, because this is a total for the month of November, whereas the rent roll is just a snapshot in time of November, so it might be a little bit different… But it should be close.

So the gross potential rent on the T-12 and the rent roll should be close enough. For example, in this T-12 it’s $195,000. We wanna see the rent roll around that $195,000, plus or minus maybe a couple hundred dollars. You don’t wanna see the rent roll with $180,000, because that means something’s wrong and there’s an inputting error somewhere. So kind of just check, to make sure that the rent roll and T-12 are actually lined up.

You’re also gonna wanna take a look at the 12-month trend. Look at each month, step-wise, and say “Okay, is the gross potential rent going up, or is it going down?” Ideally, it’s going up, because that lets you know that the rents in that market are actually trending upwards. If they initiated a value-add program on their end, you also wanna see this going up, because it should be going up if they’re renovating units, which means that they should be demanding more rent.

After acquisition, the first thing you wanna do is compare your gross potential rent to your budget, so take a look at that Variance column, to make sure that that’s a positive number, or at least a small negative number. You also wanna make sure that it’s also trending upwards.

Again, you’re doing a value-add business plan, so each month you should be renovating units and then demanding more rents, so this number should be going up.

Next you’ll see the Loss/Gain to Lease. This is going to be the income that is lost or the income that is gained due to units being rented either below or above the current market rates. If you take the rent minus the loss/gain to lease, then that is where you’ll get the actual rents that are collected from the tenants.

When you’re underwriting the deal, you want to essentially set the loss to lease to the same percentage of gross potential rent that is listed on the owner’s T-12… So you’ll wanna take the total loss to lease for the year divided by the rent, and that’ll give you a percentage. On this deal I believe the loss to lease is around 12%, which is pretty high.

The loss to lease that you’re going to have on an ongoing basis is gonna be pretty similar to what the current owner is operating at, because once you take over the property, the loss to lease is gonna be what the loss to lease percentage that the owner left you, and it’s your job to try to burn that off.

When you’re underwriting a deal, a good loss to lease that you wanna see is a 3%-5% of the gross potential rent… But if the loss to lease is 5% or higher, that’s not necessarily a bad thing, because that means that you have the opportunity to increase the current rents without having to really do anything at all besides obviously replacing current tenants with new tenants. You’re gonna be going through the whole leasing process, but you don’t have to technically do any renovations. So that’s kind of  an extra cushion of rental increase there, on top of your rental premiums.

After acquisition you want to see a loss-to-lease that is decreasing. You see on this property, starting from December 2016 to November 2016 – yeah, sure, the loss to lease for that year was 12%, but it started off as 20% in December 2016, and after a year of operations they were able to reduce the loss to lease to 9%. So a 10% reduction in loss to lease is huge. It’s an additional $20,000 in revenue that’s gained just through increasing rents to market rates.

Next we’ve got a line item called Month to Month. Generally, if a resident is not on a one-year lease – let’s say their lease expires and they don’t wanna move out, but they don’t wanna sign a  new lease, and you don’t really have anyone else to move in there, then you can just put them to a month-to-month lease; some leases will automatically go to a month-to-month lease. If that’s the case, you’re typically gonna want to charge them a fee for that, because there’s more risks to you as the owner, because they could get up and leave with 30 days’ notice, whereas for a 12-month lease you know they’re gonna be there for 12 months. So that’s just what that is – it’s an extra income that comes in from having month-to-month leases.

Next we’ve got a line item that says “Rent from subsidy/third party.” Pretty self-explanatory. It’s rent that’s paid from someone other than the tenant. The most common would be Section 8. Maybe the tenant themselves pays 50% of the rent, and then Section 8 pays the remaining 50%.

You’ve got Accelerated Rent Charges. If a resident stops paying rent, then you’re able to demand the entire balance of the remainder of their lease in one lump sum. So when you’re underwriting a deal, if there’s a lot of accelerated rent charges, then that’s the sign of a poor renter demographic that you’re gonna want to replace. Then obviously, when you have the property yourself, you want to minimize this… Even though it is income coming in, if you have a lot of accelerated rent charges it’s going to impact you negatively elsewhere, specifically in the Vacancy category.

Next on there you’ll see Delinquent Rent. Pretty self-explanatory – if a resident hasn’t paid the rent by the end of their grace period (typically 3-5 days after the first of the month), it’s considered delinquent. So however much rent that is delinquent at the time. In this rent roll there’s only one month where it looks like a few tenants hadn’t paid their rent.

If this delinquent rent is pretty high, again, this is going to be a syndicator of a poor resident demographic, who’s not paying the rent on time, and that’s something you want to keep in mind when you’re underwriting the deal.

Next we’ve got Vacancy Loss. This is going to be the income that is lost due to vacant units. If you’ve got ten units that are vacant, that could be rented at $800, your vacancy loss is going to be $8,000 for that month.

This is not the same as the vacancy rate. This is not the rate of unoccupied units, this is essentially the total money that are lost because of vacant units. So those are two different metrics.

The acceptable rate for vacancy loss is gonna vary from market to market and deal to deal, and based on the historical operation of the property… But generally, you don’t wanna see a vacancy rate that exceeds 8% to 10% while you’re doing renovations, and then 5% after renovations. So if you are underwriting the deal and see a pretty high vacancy rate, you’re gonna want to ask a couple questions about what’s going on with that, and you’re gonna wanna set your underwriting assumptions to 8% to 10% while you’re renovation, 5% to 6%(ish) or whatever the historical vacancy rate is for post-renovations, and make sure you’re sticking to that when you’re analyzing your T-12 on an ongoing basis.

Next we’ve got Employee Discounts. These are gonna be rental discounts that are given to employees who choose to live in the units.

Next we have Bad Debt. Bad Debt is gonna be money that is owed by a tenant who has moved out. When you’re underwriting, you’re gonna want to essentially set the bad debt assumption to the same percentage of gross potential rent that is listed on the owner’s T-12… So if the owner is currently getting 2%, then you’re gonna want to assume that you’re gonna get 2% as well.

Ideally, bad debt does not exceed 2% of the growth potential rent, and should ideally hover around 1%. If the bad debt is 10%, or whatever, then you’re gonna have to do some adjustments and say “Okay, well day one red 10%… Should I burn that off to 5% at the end of year one, and then eventually get to that 2% by the end of year two?”

Next you’ve got Model or Administrative Units. These are units that are vacant, but they’re not vacant because  a tenant is not living there. It’s because it’s being used for some other purpose – a model unit, and admin unit, an office.

And then the last one is going to be One-time Special or Allowance. This is going to be income that is lost due to concessions given to residents, which are usually gonna be, as it says, one-time rent specials. So you waive an application fee, you discount the rent or security deposits, things like that. These are typically offered to attract new residents to the property in order to increase the occupancy rate.

[unintelligible [00:25:52].08] 10% of the gross potential rent would be pretty insanely high… But typically it will just set your stabilized assumption to the same percentage of gross potential rent as the current owner. And your goal would be to keep concessions as long as possible.

The concessions will likely be tied to the vacancy loss. If vacancy loss goes up, concessions will also go up. As vacancy loss goes down, concessions should be going down as well.

So those are all the Rental Revenue. Let’s quickly go through the Other Income, just because typically when you’re underwriting you’re just gonna plug in your vacancy loss, or loss to lease, your bad debt, your concessions, your employee units, whereas for Other Income you’re just plugging in other income, you’re not gonna plug in late charges, and pet fees, and bad debt collection… So I’ll just quickly go over what these ones mean, but essentially Other Income is any other income that’s collected from residents that is not associated with their monthly rent.

When you’re underwriting, you’re going to want to set your stabilized Other Income assumption to the same percentage of gross potential rent that is listed on the T-12. The only way you wouldn’t is if you plan on adding something to the asset that will bring in additional income, like parking, different amenities, RUBS programs, or if you see another income fee that is abnormally high – late charges, for example; if those are really high and you plan on turning over the property and [unintelligible [00:27:16].21] then that is likely going to be reduced.

Let’s go through these throughout the episode… If you’ve got late charges, these are fees that are paid by the rents for paying the rent late. Having a high amount of consistent late charges may indicate a poor demographic. If you plan on turning over the property, this will likely be going down.

Next we have application fee income. Whenever a tenant applies for a unit, they need to fill out an application, and that requires background checks, credit checks, so typically you can charge a fee to cover those expenses on your end.

Next is pet fee. If the tenant has a pet in their unit, you can charge them a fee. Administrative fees – these are fees that cover the admin costs of leasing a unit to a new resident.

Insufficient notice penalty – this is a fee that’s paid by a resident who decides to move out without giving you sufficient notice, as defined in the lease.

Lease termination fees – fee paid by tenant who terminates the lease before the lease end date. Bad debt collection is gonna be the income from collecting the bad debt from residents who have moved out. So you’ve got your bad debt in the rental revenue, which is going to be a negative number, so it’s gonna be an actual loss, whereas the bad debt collection is going to be a positive number. Ideally, you’re collecting all of the bad debt, but it’s most likely not going to happen, which is why you account for that in your underwriting.

Lease violation fees – these are fees paid by residents who violate the terms of their lease. You’ve got reserved/covered parking fees – a tenant who decides to sign up for a reserved parking spot or a covered parking spot, or a carport, or a parking garage, or whatever parking situation you have there, you can charge a fee for that.

Amenity fee – this is a fee paid by your residents for using a certain paid amenity. NSF Fee is  non-sufficient funds. So if a resident [unintelligible [00:29:05].02] check, their credit card is rejected by the bank, so if the check bounces and the credit card is rejected, then that’s gonna cost you money, because it’s rent that you don’t have, so you can charge them a fee for that. Plus, you’ll be charged a fee by them, and you’ll wanna pass it on to your tenants.

Damage fee is a fee if the tenant damages their unit, and you fix it – you can charge them a fee for that. Same with the cleaning fee, as well. Miscellaneous Income – as it says, it’s any other income that doesn’t fit into another category. Cable TV commission – it’s commission paid to you from the cable company for essentially giving them business. If you’ve got a 200+ unit apartment building, everyone is using Spectrum cable, then if there’s multiple competing cable TV companies – which there will be – and you go with one or the other, then they’ll pay you money for helping them out.

Renters Insurance Charges – these are fees collected from the residents who decide to use your renters insurance policy. Transfer Fee – this is a  fee charged to tenants who transfer from one unit to another. Keys/Cards/Remotes – if someone loses the key or a remote to their garage, or some sort of card to get into the gym, then you can charge them a fee to replace that.

Utility Commission Income – commission paid to you from the utility company, again, for giving them business; similar to the cable TV commission.

These next line items – utility reimbursement for water/electric/trash, pest, gas, are all going to be essentially the RUBS program. So these will be the reimbursements from your residents for the water, common electric, trash, pest control, incoming gas… Then the Utility Billing Fee – since you’re paying for their utilities, if there’s any sort of fees associated with the bills that you pay, then you can pass it on to your tenants as well.

Security Deposits Forfeiture – these are income collected from residents who have to forfeit their security deposit for one reason or another. And then there’s Bad Debt/Other Income, which is, again, tied to that bad debt collection. That concludes the Other Income.

There’s this other item before we get total income, which is the Interest Income Earned. If you have an interest-earning account where you’re holding your security deposits, or your rents, then you can account for that there.

Then of course at the bottom you’re gonna have your total income. That’s the sum of all of the rental revenue line items, all of the other income line items, as well as that Interest Income Earned line item.

We’re gonna stop there, and in the next episode we’ll go through all of the expense line items, which is a lot more than income, so it’ll definitely fill up a full episode.

Just to summarize what we went over in this episode -we talked about what a T-12 is, what it’s used for during the underwriting process, and then on an ongoing basis when you’re implementing your business plan. We went over the big picture of how the T-12 flows, and then we were able to go through the first part of the T-12, which is the income section. We got through all of those and ended up at total income, and stopped before we got to the expenses, which we’ll focus on, as I said, in tomorrow’s episode.

Again, I recommend downloading this T-12 from the SyndicationSchool.com website, or from the show notes of this episode, just so you can see how it flows yourself, as well as follow along as I go through each of these different line items. Until then, I would recommend checking out the other Syndication School series episodes to learn the how-to’s of apartment syndications, and to download the T-12 free document, as well as past free documents at SyndicationSchool.com.

Thank you for listening, and I will talk to you guys tomorrow.

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